what the crap??

[longslowaccident]

Elton John and Rush Limbaugh agree on same-sex marriage

As many of you know, Elton John caused a controversy this week by performing at anti-gay marriage radio host Rush Limbaugh.

Well, as it turns out, Elton John is anti-gay marriage as well!

Says John:

“What is wrong with Proposition 8 is that they went for marriage. Marriage is going to put a lot of people off, the word marriage… I don’t want to be married. I’m very happy with a civil partnership. If gay people want to get married, or get together, they should have a civil partnership… You get the same equal rights that we do when we have a civil partnership. Heterosexual people get married. We can have civil partnerships.”

You see, both he and Rush Limbaugh are opposed to gay marriage, but support civil unions.

(source)

Because nothing makes me happier than an openly gay celebrity speaking out against gay marriage!

Seriously, this is so disappointing. Civil unions are NOT marriage, people! They don’t provide the same rights at all!

From Tumblr


my god, are you for real. then get a civil union, you jackass. other people want to get married, and they should have the basic fucking right to.

Comments

[primarycolors92.livejournal.com]

>:(

grrrrrrr

[amazonqueenkate.livejournal.com]

I kind of feeling like Elton John is being misrepresented here.

In the UK, civil partnerships have completely the same rights as marriage. It's just a different name to avoid the "marriage is sacred" kerfluffle.

While I am totally not on board with the fact that Elton John feels that marriage shouldn't be an option (because I don't think marriage is sacred, I think the term should apply to everyone, I think it's been really limiting and bigoted to have a different name for the same thing so that the icky gays aren't putting their fingers in the Christian pudding), there are a lot of people in the UK who feel the exact same way that Elton does because the rights afforded UK couples in a civil partnership are marriage rights, right down to a divorce process. The attitude there is very much, "I'm getting exactly what I want and I don't have to deal with people screaming that I am ruining the sanctity of anything, so who cares what the technical name is." A lot of gay couples go ahead and call themselves married even though they're techincally only civil-partnered.

So, while I think that's a fucked-up way of thinking, I also think representing Elton John as "against gay marriage" isn't entirely fair, because he is for all the rights afforded in marriage to be applied to gay couples, which happens in UK civil partnerships, just not in the US. (Because we are a bunch of douchebags, this side of the pond.)

[gandolforf.livejournal.com]

Okay. I didn't know that in the UK, civil partnerships afforded the same rights as marriage.

However, he did start off talking about how the issue of marriage was "what was wrong with" Prop 8--which was a major issue in the US, where civil unions and marriage do not afford the same rights. So while Elton John may not be saying something all that bad re: rights for gay couples in his own country, he's talking about rights for gay couples in this country, where there's quite a difference.

That's probably where the issues with his viewpoints arise. Mine, anyway. If he's misrepresented, he also spoke negatively about something he doesn't totally understand. And that does set people off.

[amazonqueenkate.livejournal.com]

Oh, yeah, I am in no way saying that his logic isn't flawed. I think that the whole "don't worry about the definition, worry about the rights" logic is fucked up anyway because, as Brown v. Board of Education said in the 50s, separating any two things that are meant to be equal is inherently unequal.

I'm sure he had no idea that the equality isn't there, or was trying to say that we should be fighting for the equality rather than the terminology and it came out horribly wrong. And that's really idiotic of him. But at the same time, I can't help but have a pang of but he didn't mean it like people are taking it, because I have seen a lot of breathing fire over this from people who don't understand the UK/US difference, and therefore think he was being a lot harder-line than he was.

[gandolforf.livejournal.com]

I dunno, I'm feeling a pang of it's his own damn fault if people are breathing fire at him because he had no idea what he was talking about. Everyone's human and makes mistakes, but I feel that someone with such a celebrity status as he ought to either know the details and the reality of a situation before speaking on it, or deal with peoples' reactions to how he's come across.

In some ways, I think hearing the logic behind his logic makes the statement worse--it's like rubbing it in the faces of gay couples in the US, because where he comes from, the issue is full of semantics, not rights. I'm very put off of him, saying what was "wrong" with Prop 8 like the people fighting for rights are just being whiny and nitpicky, and...to me he sounded very condescending. I'm not very eloquent right now, and it's hard to explain how I'm seeing this. (Being terribly frustrated with Emmy today isn't helping.) I think you can probably get what I mean, though. I'm sure it's very easy for him to know what's wrong with gay rights issues in the United States when he has equal rights where he lives. I don't blame people at all for breathing fire, whether because of the statement, the intent, or the ignorance.

And because of his status, his statement doesn't help equal rights at all--it only helps anti-gay marriage people go, "See? THIS guy is gay and he thinks a civil union is JUST FINE! Why do you guys have to keep pushing in on our marriage?" (Naturally, I don't expect most people who are against gay marriage to know all the facts about which countries have equal rights under what terminologies.) I don't give the benefit of the doubt to the masses, and...it just burns me more that his statement was all fine and true for equal rights in the UK, yet he knows exactly what was wrong with Prop 8 in America, and is, whether intended or not, spreading the "stfu and get a civil union and be glad you get THAT" mentality. I almost want to call it Equal Rights Privileged. He's got it, so it's not a big deal to make sure everyone else has it, too. Maybe if he knew how different it is in America versus the UK he wouldn't have phrased what he said like he did, or not said it at all, but that doesn't help him now. It's...ignorant and condescending and privileged. (Ha, a basic human right is a privilege argument now. Yay.)

I'm probably not making sense, or not getting across what I mean. The basic gist I guess is that I don't think that's not how he meant it is an excuse at all, and that it really just makes it worse. Sorry for the teal deer.

[amazonqueenkate.livejournal.com]

I do know what you mean. Absolutely. And I wasn't meaning to absolutely excuse what he said because, like I said, I have a lot of problems with the fundemental argument behind what he was saying. I think this is part of the problem with the whole gay rights fight in general, though: we (Americans) know what we want, but we aren't aware of other countries and vise versa. I think there are a lot of countries, the UK included, who would be up in arms about how shitty the gay people here get treated by the government and other organizations, because a large number of the first-world contries we consider ourselves comparible to do have equal rights under law, be it marriage or civil partnership. We are behind the times in a big way and sticking our heels in the mud to catch up.

I understand that the "masses," as you call them, will misinterpret what he said to be absolutely against gay marriage and therefore equal rights, and I do think that is his stupidity and his mistake. I also think that even if he were to retract his statement, people at this point wouldn't hear it.

His choice of words and, indeed, perhaps talking at all, was very ill-concieved, I'm not denying that, I just wanted to point out the fact that it was a lack of education (or thought) on his part because most of the people who are angry about it don't understand the US/UK thing, and I have a compulsive need to educate. ;)

[sarcasticsra]

aksjaldjaslkdjskladlaskjdas grrrrrrrrr fffffffffff

Aaaaand I think that's about as eloquent as I'm going to get for now.

[subluxate]

Oh ffs.

[enlisted-smile.livejournal.com]

I kinda saw this coming. I'm really not surprised.

[honeystix.livejournal.com]

a) The author of that article makes me want to punch him in the face. He sounds so fucking condescending the entire time, and he's a hypocritical asshole -- pleading for "civility" while calling the ladies on The View "hags?" Please, dipshit, get your head out of your ass.

b) WTF, Elton? I understand that gay rights in the UK are waaaaay better than here in the US -- I'm super happy you have marriage and all its rights and privileges under a different name, but you have to understand: In the US, a civil partnership is not equal to marriage. Plain and simple. Please know basic facts before you make an ass out of yourself.